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Post by logan9a on Mar 7, 2017 20:28:51 GMT
...and now I'm thinking "I don't even know what the various Cyberpunk rule books say about netrunning. At all."
Computer use. Computer hacking. Electronic lock picking.
Did I miss anything?
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Post by logan9a on Mar 7, 2017 20:42:08 GMT
A better question might be "Hey, Logan what skills do you think are needed to break into something like a Best Buy?" (Disclaimer: I do not want to break into any stores.)
Do you think we can watch the camera feeds from the safety of our home?
Oh hell no. The words 'closed circuit' come to mind. Am I right on what it means? Quite probably not but honestly - who would want to sit there and watch that who isn't working there?
I think the big thing would be to 'cut the line' (or disable in some way) whatever it is that lets the police know someone is being naughty there. If you can do that, the only people you'd have to deal with are the on site ones - unless they have a cellphone and can remember that 911 number. But if you are jamming that as well, then do they have a land line? If you've cut that then they are reduced to smoke signals or something.
Doc Fulton would be a good person (on these boards) to ask about past Cyberpunk type adventures I ran. I'll see if I can jangle him on FB to come here and tell you what they were like.
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Post by bentpaperclip on Mar 7, 2017 20:43:25 GMT
From Shadowrun 2nd - they've significantly reduced/consolidated that list since then I believe as no one wants to play a decker.
Knowledge: *Computer Theory *Hardware *Mainframes *Implant Tech *Interface Tech *Micros *Headware *Bodyware *Cybertechnology *Software *Decking *Implant Programming *Interface Programming *Non-Matrix Programming *Matrix Programming *Matrix Theory Electronics Build/Repair *Communications *(device type) *Vehicular *Security Computer Build/Repair *Turtles *Cybernetics *Mainframes *Cyberdecks Technical *Biotech *Extended Care/Nursing *Triage *Transimplant Surgery *Headware *Organic Replacements *Bodyware *Psychotherapy *Replacement Construction *Organ *Limb *Organ Culture *Organ *Limb *First Aid Electronics *Control Systems *Interfacing *Maglocks *Electronic Warfare *Diagnostics *Analog *Digital *Computer **Hardware **Mainframes **Implant Tech **Interface Tech **Micros **Software **Decking **Implant Programming **Interface Programming **Non-Matrix Programming **Matrix Programming
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Post by bentpaperclip on Mar 7, 2017 20:45:36 GMT
A better question might be "Hey, Logan what skills do you think are needed to break into something like a Best Buy?" (Disclaimer: I do not want to break into any stores.) Do you think we can watch the camera feeds from the safety of our home? Oh hell no. The words 'closed circuit' come to mind. Am I right on what it means? Quite probably not but honestly - who would want to sit there and watch that who isn't working there? I think the big thing would be to 'cut the line' (or disable in some way) whatever it is that lets the police know someone is being naughty there. If you can do that, the only people you'd have to deal with are the on site ones - unless they have a cellphone and can remember that 911 number. But if you are jamming that as well, then do they have a land line? If you've cut that then they are reduced to smoke signals or something. Doc Fulton would be a good person (on these boards) to ask about past Cyberpunk type adventures I ran. I'll see if I can jangle him on FB to come here and tell you what they were like. Logan...what you describe isn't Shadowrun...it's an average Tuesday.
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Post by bentpaperclip on Mar 7, 2017 20:48:20 GMT
It appears Shadowrun 5e has reduced decker skills to:
Cracking -Cybercombat -Electronic Warfare -Hacking
Electronics -Computer -Hardware -Software
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Post by logan9a on Mar 7, 2017 20:54:34 GMT
Logan's take on these skills: *Computer Theory - WTF *Hardware - You building them? *Mainframes - Haven't called on this skill...er...ever. *Implant Tech - possibly a ripper doc thing but I'd just use something like 'cybernetics + medicine + electronics. *Interface Tech - don't use it *Micros - WTF is this *Headware - no *Bodyware - no *Cybertechnology - aka cybernetics see above. This plus either electronics (with replacement parts) or jury rig (without replacement parts) would be dandy. *Software -use 'computers' *Decking - use computers *Implant Programming - don't use it *Interface Programming - don't use it *Non-Matrix Programming - don't use it *Matrix Programming - don't use it *Matrix Theory - LOL. Note that IRL the matrix would be cool but aside from describing 'flashing lights' and probably a lot of pyramids, it really comes down to 'did you get the info you wanted'. Electronics Build/Repair - I think we have this in HC. *Communications - you could use electronics to operate it. To build it possibly as well. *(device type) - I don't know *Vehicular - Building or modifying vehicles - repair mechanical *Security - I think we have this in HC - security systems. Computer Build/Repair - sure, but why? They're not expensive. *Turtles - You see a turtle - you flip it on it's back. Why do you do that? *Cybernetics - wasn't this listed above twice? *Mainframes - still no *Cyberdecks - still no Technical *Biotech - nothing I love better than a group of PC's hanging out in a lab for a couple years while plot rolls by. Pay someone or steal their shit. *Extended Care/Nursing - honestly this has never come up. *Triage - first aid or medicine. *Transimplant Surgery - don't use it. *Headware - still no. *Organic Replacements - medicine *Bodyware - no. *Psychotherapy - I think we have this in HC - psychology/psychiatry *Replacement Construction - get a big white machine that costs a lot of money *Organ - nope *Limb - nope *Organ Culture - nope *Organ - nope *Limb - nope *First Aid - a tried and true HC skill! Electronics *Control Systems - Electonic lock picking for most of this crap. Or electronics. *Interfacing - see above *Maglocks - see above
*Electronic Warfare - see above
*Diagnostics - see above
*Analog *Digital *Computer **Hardware **Mainframes **Implant Tech **Interface Tech **Micros **Software **Decking **Implant Programming **Interface Programming **Non-Matrix Programming **Matrix Programming
All those seem to be repeating. So not a whole lot of 'new skills' there.
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Post by logan9a on Mar 7, 2017 20:57:29 GMT
A better question might be "Hey, Logan what skills do you think are needed to break into something like a Best Buy?" (Disclaimer: I do not want to break into any stores.) Do you think we can watch the camera feeds from the safety of our home? Oh hell no. The words 'closed circuit' come to mind. Am I right on what it means? Quite probably not but honestly - who would want to sit there and watch that who isn't working there? I think the big thing would be to 'cut the line' (or disable in some way) whatever it is that lets the police know someone is being naughty there. If you can do that, the only people you'd have to deal with are the on site ones - unless they have a cellphone and can remember that 911 number. But if you are jamming that as well, then do they have a land line? If you've cut that then they are reduced to smoke signals or something. Doc Fulton would be a good person (on these boards) to ask about past Cyberpunk type adventures I ran. I'll see if I can jangle him on FB to come here and tell you what they were like. Logan...what you describe isn't Shadowrun...it's an average Tuesday. Yes, I know Tuesday is traditionally 'Death to Best Buy' day but I do have a limited knowledge of many things. If you want a shiny new cyber arm, get some creds together, go and get one installed. Have insurance just in case I can't roll below a 00. Actually, something like that happened once. A guy wanted a cyber arm as his regular arm had been broken off or something. The doc fumbled so I gave him a 'Mr. Studd' implant instead. Although he didn't complain about that, they did have to go to a different doctor. Sure, it turns out his dick was prehensile and had a mind of it's own but that's a different story.
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Post by logan9a on Mar 7, 2017 20:58:42 GMT
It appears Shadowrun 5e has reduced decker skills to: Cracking -Cybercombat -Electronic Warfare -Hacking Electronics -Computer -Hardware -Software Those I can reduce even further. You're not going to need hardware unless you are building some unholy machine to give yourself some small bonus to hacking. Computer use hacking electronics? Er...
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Post by bentpaperclip on Mar 7, 2017 20:59:01 GMT
Shadowrun differentiated between "knowing stuff" and "doing stuff" and "fixing stuff." So a gunman might neeed Shooting (Pistols), Repair (Pistols) and Knowledge (Pistols) to cover all his bases. The same applied to tech skills.
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Post by logan9a on Mar 7, 2017 21:02:42 GMT
The 'knowing pistols' part is assumed with some skill. In the past, if someone wanted to know what sort of pistol the bad guy had pointed at them, I might have them make a pistol roll. Figured if they were really good with pistols, they were probably the sort of person who studied them.
If failed, the answer might be 'shiny' or something.
But yeah - with computers and stuff there are honestly not a lot of skills to know. I'm a bit like Hollywood in that respect. Don't know shit about it. If someone is typing really fast on their keyboard and ignoring their mouse, they must be hacking. In reality, I think if they clicked the 'run big bad program' button then sat back it would probably work better but with less frantic movement for dramatic effect.
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Post by bentpaperclip on Mar 7, 2017 21:03:09 GMT
The greater point, which I think we've gotten away from, is the PCs need to rely on NPC competency when the GM achieves near orgasmic delight in making all NPCs woefully incompetent. We will avoid said interaction with NPCs at all costs which will color our choices in game. The shadowrun example was just that - an example.
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Post by logan9a on Mar 7, 2017 21:05:51 GMT
Honestly, the players would do much better in a smokey room that smells like sweat talking to Sergie:
Travis: "You have what we wanted?" Sergie slides a folded newspaper across the table but keeps his hand on it. Sergie: "Do you have what I asked for?" Travis moves a briefcase across with his foot under the table. Sergie smiles and removes his hand from the folded newspaper. Travis: "If these don't work, you're going to have problems." Sergie: "My best work."
After the security badges folded in the newspaper failed, Sergie died horribly. Francisco was then hired.
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Post by bentpaperclip on Mar 7, 2017 21:06:57 GMT
I think Doyle made attack rolls for an NPC named Rocky the Intern. But then again...he was a rock...and Doyle threw him.
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Post by logan9a on Mar 7, 2017 21:07:11 GMT
The greater point, which I think we've gotten away from, is the PCs need to rely on NPC competency when the GM achieves near orgasmic delight in making all NPCs woefully incompetent. We will avoid said interaction with NPCs at all costs which will color our choices in game. The shadowrun example was just that - an example. Well, yeah. But I can't control the dice. I do give them good skills. Sometimes I even (as you know) say the skills in advance of rolling. If that shit comes up horrible, what can you do? Not everyone is a poz wielding super hero.
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Post by logan9a on Mar 7, 2017 21:11:57 GMT
The greater point, which I think we've gotten away from, is the PCs need to rely on NPC competency when the GM achieves near orgasmic delight in making all NPCs woefully incompetent. We will avoid said interaction with NPCs at all costs which will color our choices in game. The shadowrun example was just that - an example. Well, you did threaten not to play an entire genre worth of stuff sir.
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