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Post by logan9a on Mar 2, 2017 17:45:02 GMT
How is this? HOW TO USE FULL AUTO Previously, the full auto rules have been overly complicated and tend to drag things out. Something quicker: The shooter can designate up to three targets. GM assigns a penalty for all the shots. The penalty may be very light (say -10%) when the targets are caught in a fatal funnel up to severe (say -60% for well spread out targets). [Note that the GM may say that if - for example two targets are close together and one is well away, they get for example a -50% for trying all three where as they might have only gotten a -20% for limiting their fire to the two close together. Since I refuse to turn the game into chess with maps and such, the PC can declare something like "If there is an easy group of two or three guys I'm going to hose them down with full auto fire." The GM can say there is a kind of easy -30% group and the player can go for that.] The shooter rolls to hit each target. The negatives are the same on all targets. Those who are hit take the 'full auto' damage of the weapon. Done. Special note: If you are spraying an area where your buddy - or buddies - are it is entirely possible to hit both your target and them. Friendly fire isn't. I don't recommend shooting at anything near your buddies. However, shit happens. The GM may call for rolls depending on how malicious he or she is feeling. This can be partially (or sometimes completely) offset by use of the 'tactics' (CQC) skill. See also en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Close_quarters_combat
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Post by bentpaperclip on Mar 2, 2017 18:04:17 GMT
1. Choose targets. 2. GM assigns penalty (which applies to all attack rolls) 3. Make 1 attack roll per target. 4. Roll damage (modified for full auto) on each successful attack.
Is that accurate?
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Post by logan9a on Mar 2, 2017 18:09:20 GMT
Yes - did I put it in a less clear way?
Fuck it - I'll just copy/paste your way into the rules sheet I'm keeping. It just seems easier.
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Post by logan9a on Mar 2, 2017 18:09:38 GMT
PS: Does this way seem reasonable?
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Scott
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Post by Scott on Mar 4, 2017 19:53:19 GMT
Did we decide what the full auto damage means?
Edit: Okay, now I've read the damage track post...I'd say the penalties are almost never going to be worth it for the +1.5-2.5 damage that you are going to gain against one target. Unless we are saying that auto fire is the only way to roll more than one attack? Then can I use it and pick the same guy to target all 3 times?
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Post by logan9a on Mar 4, 2017 20:39:39 GMT
Did we decide what the full auto damage means? Edit: Okay, now I've read the damage track post...I'd say the penalties are almost never going to be worth it for the +1.5-2.5 damage that you are going to gain against one target. Unless we are saying that auto fire is the only way to roll more than one attack? Then can I use it and pick the same guy to target all 3 times? A good question but I was imagining full auto as the way to be able to attack more than one person at a time - not the same guy three times. If I wanted full auto to remain that deadly, I'd have not changed it.
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Scott
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Post by Scott on Mar 4, 2017 21:25:06 GMT
So I have a light rifle (d8).
I can shoot the one guy with one bullet at full skill for a d8.
Or I can autofire and hit him with 10ish bullets for a d12. (is there still a -10% penalty on this?)
Or I can spray him and the two guys right next to with 10ish bullets at -10% for 3d12 damage.
I guess I'm trying to make sense out of multiplying damage only when more people happen to be standing there. That makes sense for AoEs but not autofire. Can we just treat it as an AoE then?
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Post by logan9a on Mar 4, 2017 21:35:31 GMT
So I have a light rifle (d8). I can shoot the one guy with one bullet at full skill for a d8. Or I can autofire and hit him with 10ish bullets for a d12. (is there still a -10% penalty on this?) No. Or I can spray him and the two guys right next to with 10ish bullets at -10% for 3d12 damage. With each of them getting 1d12. I guess I'm trying to make sense out of multiplying damage only when more people happen to be standing there. That makes sense for AoEs but not autofire. Can we just treat it as an AoE then? How do you mean?
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Scott
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Post by Scott on Mar 4, 2017 22:40:14 GMT
Oh, good. With each of them getting 1d12. Yes, that's what I meant. Well, it could mean picking a square area (say 10x10) and rolling one attack at the penalty and then everything in the area takes the weapon damage. (GM discretion on collateral damage) More realistically, it could mean that the area that you can autofire in would be treated as a right circular cone. (that means it has an end diameter equal to its length.) So you pick up to three targets. No 2 of them can be farther apart laterally than they are at range from you because they would not all be in the cone. Yay, geometry! To KISS, the penalty could be the lateral distance of the 2 farthest apart targets. Roll one attack at the penalty to hit all the targets for weapon damage. Anything behind and/or in a direct path between the targets may also take some damage (GM discretion).
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Post by logan9a on Mar 4, 2017 22:50:19 GMT
Not sure how well that would work for someone who despises battle mats, maps, placement of small figures on maps, etc.
Which is why I was leaning toward 1, 2 or 3 targets.
Edit: Also, if you are bringing up geometry, you know you are wrong already. Simple math is about as far as we go here. Beyond 'half' and 'a quarter' is GURPs.
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Post by bentpaperclip on Mar 6, 2017 11:43:57 GMT
I think you could full auto one person. It would still be three attack rolls at penalties (each with a potential for failure) and for damage either roll d12 three times or each success could be two more shifts. (The second option is kinder to the person being shot)
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Post by logan9a on Mar 6, 2017 11:46:39 GMT
But (from above).
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Post by bentpaperclip on Mar 6, 2017 11:55:00 GMT
You changed it from 1d20 bullets hitting you for full damage each. That is VERY deadly. What is being proposed makes using 10 bullets more damaging than 3 bullets but still keeps it survivable. Your way makes it *impossible* to fire more than 3 bullets at someone with any weapon ever.
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Post by logan9a on Mar 6, 2017 16:28:31 GMT
You changed it from 1d20 bullets hitting you for full damage each. That is VERY deadly. What is being proposed makes using 10 bullets more damaging than 3 bullets but still keeps it survivable. Your way makes it *impossible* to fire more than 3 bullets at someone with any weapon ever. I'm concerned that 3d12 (or more - what about special ammo?) damage will spell as much death to people as 20d10. Though the average damage is far apart, 19(?) or so damage on (possibly plus special ammo) will still kill them. On average.
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Post by bentpaperclip on Mar 6, 2017 16:44:12 GMT
The more I think about it the less sense it makes to increase damage for full auto when you're shooting multiple targets. Since there's more targets, shouldn't that mean there are less bullets each (since they are spread out)?
What if full auto did normal damage (or maybe one shift) against (GM specified number of targets, based on circumstances) and did +3 shifts if you focused all the bullets on just one guy?
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